Q&A: Showrunner Randy Farrell & EP Marshall Goldberg Talk 'Justice USA'

The documentary series Justice USA premiered today on Max and it is not at all what you might expect from the name. The season was filmed in Nashville over the course of seven months in 2022 and rather than being some knock-off of a cop friendly show you'll find on A&E or Investigation Discovery, this series focuses on the justice system as a whole - especially as it relates to juveniles, poverty, addiction and mental illness. It shows people on every side of the issue struggling to make the best decisions in the middle of a chaotic and sometimes unjust process.

I recently spoke with showrunner Randy Farrell and executive producer Marshall Goldberg about the series. The conversation was incredibly enlightening and we 

Q: The first shot viewers see in the series is a note mentioning the show was nine years in the making. Which is a long period to plan a project and I'm wondering how the final results looked in comparison to the vision you had nearly a decade ago?

Marshall Goldberg: There is a case called "Gideon Vs. Wainwright" and it said that "if you cannot afford a lawyer, one will be provided for you. And I came across a guy who was immersed in showing that's a sham. Public defenders handle 500 felony cases a year. So what kind of representation can you get?

Originally, I wanted to do something just on public defenders. And the final project expanded to include the whole justice system not just the public defenders. But in some sense, the project hasn't changed: "What is it like to be the client of someone who handles 500 cases a year?"

Q: One of the challenging themes that runs throughout the series is the definition of justice. Do you just want to punish people for the crime that they did? Or does justice include some component of redemption and a change of behavior that might lower the future crime rate? What was it like as filmmakers to try and navigate these very complex questions and show all sides of the story?

Randy Farrell: In this media climate, in this world we live in, people love to have agendas. They love to be in their silos. And we wanted to just come in and be flies on the wall. Just put our cameras there and see what happens: good, bad, ugly or otherwise.

That was our approach and that was our North Star. We never wanted to bring our personal thoughts about the justice system into it. We wanted to see what happened to real people. And I think if you look at the system as something robotic and you extract the humanity from it, then I think you can dismiss it very easily. 

Once you meet all of these people - the judges, the defendants, the lawyers, the sheriff's deputies - you start to realize these are human beings going through situations. And it's really unique and interesting to have the access to see how they handle it. So it was all about the approach.

Marshall Goldberg: And I would just in and say that justice is so focused on incarceration that you begin to wonder, "What's the purpose of incarceration?" What are we gaining by incarcerating mentally ill people? What are we gaining by incarcerating drug addicts? And it goes back to what Randy said. It's the humanity of the situation that drives people to question the value of incarceration.

Q: One of the interesting things about focusing on Nashville is that there a perception there that there is a huge problem with juvenile crime. Lots of addiction. And that seems to be impacting what is happening in the justice system there.

Randy Farrell: Some of it is perception. We were at a screening yesterday with Judge Calloway and she was telling us that juvenile crime is actually down. But you've seen some of these very high profiles crimes - murders, armed robberies, things like that - that scare people. And so that is one part of it.

Marshall Goldberg: There is statistics and then there's the reputation. The system in Nashville diverts 70% of the kids who are arrested into these programs. They believe that the more contact juveniles have with the criminal justice system, the more likely they are to become adult criminals. Of that 70%, only 4% are rearrested. Which is a remarkably low recidivism rate. 

So I don't think the statistics don't bear out the reputation.

Randy Farrell: There's clearly an issue. People in Nashville will tell you stories about juveniles breaking into cars and stealing guns and things like that. But I think the focus in Nashville's juvenile justice system is to rehabilitate and many people as possible. And I think Judge Calloway gives viewers a good perspective into her approach. Which is to try and rehabilitate as many kids as she can. Whatever she needs to do to keep as many kids out of the system, that is what she's going to do. I think she is really the moral center of this series. 



Q: I suspect a lot of people ask you about the emotional toil doing a story like this has on you. You're getting close enough to people to gain their trust, it's inevitable that on some level you become invested in their outcomes. And even watching these stories, there are times when you just want to shake someone and say "Don't do this, it is not going to end well!"

How did you navigate that line between caring about the people you followed but not let that connection get in the way of dispassionately  telling their story?

Marshall Goldberg: Some people wonder how I could put up with this for seven months: drug addicts, mentally ill people. People who were arrested for murder. We have a lot of people in there who were arrested for first-degree murder. But I think it was the most profound experience of my life - outside of becoming a parent. 

And it's because it forces you to be honest and open and face another human being. If we weren't open and trusting with them, we weren't going to have a film. We were asking them to be honest with us. So we have to be honest back. And when you connect to someone on that level, to the point that they're really willing to open up, it is so regenerative as a human being. It is profound to really connect with someone on that level. 

So I came away from Nashville not exhausted but in a way exhilarated by that contact with humanity.

Randy Farrell: And building on what Marshall said, for me personally, when people ask me "Oh, what did you learn about the system," I didn't learn anything personally. I didn't learn about the system. I learned about people. 

And it's really true. We met these people, we introduced ourselves as humans before we introduced ourselves as filmmakers. We gave them an ear when nobody else probably would. So you start to see things. You start to care for people. And I think that shows in the film and I think it makes the audience care for these people. That's the core of any story. It's the people whose stories you're telling. 

Justice USA is available now on Max.